If you are in the new truck market, read this before buying. - SaltwaterCentral.Com

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Timorjc
Posts: 991
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Wed Jul 24, 2019 6:00 am
So, I decided it was new truck time and started the process of narrowing down what I wanted and who to buy from. This was the first new truck I have purchased since 2008, and only the second trully brand new vehicle I have ever purchased out of the dozens I have owned. I am a no BS kind of guy when it comes to buying vehicles. Don't lie to me. Just be real.

I looked at the GMC Sierra AT4 6.2L first. I liked the truck alot and found a used one on the lot at Bob King that had about 1400 miles on it. I researched the truck online, knew what true dealer cost, holdback, ect was, compaired it to what Laura GMC had them at, and KBB fair price. I had a number in mind and talked with one of the sales managers. It blew my mind when he quoted $1600 more than the MSRP of a new one across the street and then proceeded to tell me how "rare" these trucks are. Hey, Ahol, there are 10 of them sitting within eyesight across the street from us right now. One of my first questions was why did they have a used truck with 1400 miles on it? After rounds and rounds I pulled my own CarFax on the truck and only then did they finally admit it was a lemon and bought back due to electrical issues with the Nav/Sound system. At that point I was done with them, but not necessarily with GMCs. I continued to shop GMCs, but finally just decided they must be made from unicorn farts and unobtainium since they were so damn expensive. They were literally 10-15% or more higher than comparable trucks of other makes. Even from Laura GMC after T&T&T and shipping it to NC it was over $62k for a 1/2 to pick-up and you would be hard pressed to find one locally for that price.

Then I went to Capital Ford. I looked hard at the F150, but was interested in the 3.5L Ecoboost, and not the 2.7L and 5.0L. They didn't have the exact truck I wanted, and the salesman kept steering me towards either the 2.7L or a F250 diesel. I finally got frustrated with him and left. I came back a couple days later and talked to another guy. I told him the options and packages I would want, even gave him the print out from Fords build your truck website, and made it clear I was cash in hand ready to buy. After a few days and no word I called him. Three more days and I sent a text. Finally, 9 days after my second visit to the dealer he gets back to me. We talk numbers, I drive over there the next day for a look at a truck they swapped another dealer for and then they hit me with a price that had $8k in dealer crap added to it. $1700 document process fee, $1400 paint protection package, ect ect ect. Their price actually came out over the inflated MSRP after dealer add-ons and more than their advertised price of an F250 Diesel Lariat, BEFORE T&T&T. I got pretty heated at this point and figured I better leave before I did something stupid. They were THOUSANDS over their competitors.

I also gave Fairway Ford a chance at the same truck, and although they were ALOT closer to reality on price, they were also in the over $60k OTD realm on a half ton truck. I'm sorry, but that will never happen for me.

During the process of looking at these two dealers, I also considered Neworth Ram. I looked at the Ram Rebel and liked the truck. I actually would have bought the truck, but two different times I went there to look at trucks that were specific to what I wanted and they sold them before I had an opportunity. They seemed willing to deal and were not crazy high on price. Had they had a truck on the lot long enough I probably would be driving it. They seemed understaffed and nobody seemed to know what trucks they had or where they were. I actually called their number from the lot twice to inquire if they had a specific truck while the salesman standing next to me waited for the answer. Overall, it was just a very chaotic and unprofessional environment.

My last Wilmington stop was the Toyota dealer. I looked at the Tundra TRD Pro, a Limited, and a basic SR5. I got the salesman to get his manager and we sat down and talked about the Limited. I drove the truck TWICE, and was ready to make a deal. The price they hit me with was so freaking ridiculous that I laughed at them. I did the research. I knew what the truck went for before stepping in the door. I was just floored. Did these idiots really think they could sell this truck to me at THOUSANDS over MSRP? I cut my losses and left. They must think that since Ford and GM can sell trucks for $65k, so can they.

I went home and gave it alot of thought for a few days and decided the Tundra Platinum CrewMax SR5 5.7L in Midnight Black was what I wanted and started shopping it online. I literally checked every Toyota dealer in the Southern USAs inventory and called dozens of dealers. I checked Costco Auto and Sams Club, and multiple car buying websites. I found 4 with the exact options I wanted. One at Modern Toyota in Winston Salem, one at Fred Anderson in Sanford, one at Sparks in Myrtle Beach, and ironically enough, one at Hendrick Toyota in Wilmington (the dealer mentioned above). They had received one in since I had been there.

So here is the break-down on the truck I bought. Sticker before dealer add-ons was $58,760 and $62,714 after the dealer crap. True dealer cost, plus delivery, minus holdback is $40,210. Add T&T&T in NC and that's about $42,800 OTD as a break even point for the dealer.

Sparks came back pretty high and had alot of inflated add ons. We exchanged a few calls and they basically said the OTD before NC taxes (about $1800) was $54,790, for a cost to me of $56,590. They came down about $500 more dollars and that was it. Take it or leave it at $56k.

Now, pay attention to this next part....

Fred Anderson came back with $46,854 out the door, everything included. Already $10k less on THE SAME EXACT TRUCK. They were firm at this price and would not budge. They were polite and easy to talk to, and I would give them a shot in the future.

Then Modern Toyota came in within $100 of Fred Anderson. I talked with Wes Wheeler, the salesman, and said, look...this is what I will do, you ship me that truck to Wilmington tomorrow and I will hand you a check for $44,800 all in, out the door.($42,800+T&T&T+$320 doc fee) This was at a point where they would make about $2k on the truck and I was about $3k under the "low" end of KBB fair buying range. I didn't hear back right away and continued to shop.

For fun, I went back to the dealer here in Wilmington and told them that they were thousands off their competitors and asked them to bid this truck. I gave them the window sticker minus the vin so it was a true apples to apples comparison and they had that trucks twin parked on the lot. They can see from their computer systems what dealers I had talked to and they knew exactly the truck in question. I made it clear that my bank was within walking distance and I would go get a check right now. $54,810. That Stealership was $10,010 higher on the same exact truck ON THEIR BEST PRICE!!!!

So, to end this long journey and hopefully keep some of you from getting screwed over, it pays to shop outside of Wilmington. I saved over $10k on a truck for a couple days worth of work shopping around. Modern Toyota in Winston Salem called me back the next day. I held firm to my offer and we made the deal. They delivered a clean truck full of gas with all promises met. It literally took 5 minutes to sign the papers and hand them a check. They didn't try to BS me or screw me over. They wanted to make a profit and did, but also wanted referral business and repeat customers. Modern Toyota of Winston Salem will get more money from me and my friends in the future than the rest of these Stealerships ever will.

And as far as the Tundra goes,....it is awesome. The mileage is actually a little better than the window sticker, which helps because it still isn't good.(average 18.1 city driving. Sticker says 13city, 18hwy. I get 18.7 at 74mph hand calculation over distance) It is very smooth, quiet, comfortable and well designed. Tons of power. It pulls a 5800# load like it isn't even there and gets about 11mpg doing it. The only two points of improvement would be better breaks and better mpgs.

Anyway, I thought I would share this experience.

Tim
  
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Capt_Dave
Posts: 11979
Location: Cape Fear, NC
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Wed Jul 24, 2019 9:04 am
The price of trucks Id just flat stupid. I was going to buy an F350 not long ago but would not come off $30k for a truck with well over 100k miles. No no and no! I currently drive a 2004 f250 with 240k on it and it is bought and paid for......

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baitcrank
Posts: 266
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Wed Jul 24, 2019 10:34 am
We just saved $1800 on a Highlander last week in Jacksonville. yes I will drive an hour for $1800, George Papajohn gave us the deal over the phone. Nice drive and ride home....
Bryan Honda was $2000 cheaper on my wife's Honda CRV in 2013 and they delivered it to our house to sign papers......cheaper outside of Wilmington without a doubt...
  
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scdiver
Posts: 84
Location: Murrells Inlet, SC
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Wed Jul 24, 2019 11:36 am
I love a small town dealership.

Glad you got what you were looking for.

Haselden Ford earned my business the same way. No BS, just tell me what the truck costs and let's get it done.
  
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werewolf0711
Posts: 3085
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Wed Jul 24, 2019 2:06 pm
$60k plus and you should be talking a diesel at that point not a 1500. Truck prices are through the roof and they will only continue to creep higher and higher until things pop. Kinda like the boat market
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Matador
Posts: 4175
Location: Johnston County, NC
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Wed Jul 24, 2019 6:22 pm
Im in the truck and boat market right now. Im waiting on a correction before I buy. I have bought houses for investment purposes much cheaper than what they are asking for the bigger diesel trucks. Absolutely insane even if I can write off a lot of the cost.
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zigzag
Posts: 2066
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Wed Jul 24, 2019 6:54 pm
well I have bought my last new one, I am driving a 2018 F150 Lariat and it is the most expensive vehicle I ever owned and absolutely the sorriest piece of crap I ever drove, and dear old Ford has been working on a software fix for their steering since last October, glad to hear you ended up in a Tundra, that could be my next truck, thanks for the heads up.  
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DOGKILLR
Posts: 1115
Location: Mooresville, NC and Harkers Island
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Wed Jul 24, 2019 7:26 pm
I try to buy second hand vehicles. Let someone else take the ass wippin, get tired of it after a year or so, then put it up for sale. I always thought that the smell of a new vehicle doesn't seem to last as long as the payments or the time to put the money back into the bank.
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fishing-misfit
Posts: 76
Location: Hampstead NC
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Wed Jul 24, 2019 10:43 pm
Two years ago I was had been thinking a lot about trading my Cadillac Escalade for a new Escalade, GMC Denali or Tahoe Premier. I was in town driving my 2005 Dodge dually and thought, I will go by Bob King GMC and look at a Denali. Immediately found one I liked and told the salesman I wanted to drive it. On the way back to dealership, I noticed that he kept looking at his phone. Got back and I was looking the truck over and he stood off to the side texting then came over and I could tell he wanted me to hurry up, guess he was missing his lunch date. I said "I would like to talk to your finance guy to see about lease versus purchase options for my business, pros/cons for my business because I have never leased". This was his response, "apparently you don't know how expensive the payments are on a truck like this, maybe you should look at the base model Yukon or the used trucks". I have ran across some asshole car salesmen but really didn't think there were some out there that stupid. I preceded to tell him that I know the payments could be up to $1000 with a minimal down payment, but I wanted information on lease options. But I am not trading my dually (even though it was a nice truck), I am trading my low mileage garage kept, excellent condition Escalade with title in hand and will pay up to $20k cash, then finance the remainder if I purchase instead of lease. What do you know, he was then wanting to miss his lunch date and be friends. I told him in the most professional way to screw himself, I came here to buy a truck today and because I didn't get out of my Escalade wearing a suit, you thought I couldn't afford a $80k truck. But there is a Cadillac dealer around the corner and Chevy dealer within eyesight, so I am going to buy a truck. Went to Cadillac dealership and couldn't believe that I got similar treatment. Went to Chevy dealership, picked out a loaded Tahoe Premier, test drove it, I want this one. I told them about the Escalade and this is what I will take on trade. Went home to get Escalade and when I got back to dealership, they had most paperwork complete, looked at the Escalade and agreed to what I wanted on trade. Done deal. Last year I test drove a Ram 3500 Limited dually at Neuwirth, 2 weeks later (without appointment) I drove my 2005 Dodge dually up there one morning when they opened. Within 2 hours we had made a deal and I was driving my new Ram home. Same thing when my Wife purchased a Dodge Challenger at Neuwirth, she test drove it, no trade, negoliated with cash down and deal was done. I have been thinking about trading the Tahoe for another Escalade, I will be going out of town if I make that trade. I will not go back to the Cadillac or GMC dealers in town.
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jdunk
Posts: 279
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Thu Jul 25, 2019 3:04 pm
I have purchased through costco auto program with Modern Toyota and can Say absolute best car buying experience ever and it was handled exactly as the OP said. It is really worth your time to give these guys and gals a chance... I spent 2 weeks making a deal with another dealer on a 2002 model year new pickup. Modern came in $2800 Less the first time I talked to them on a 2003 model year. They delivered it to the house full tank and I signed the papers and was done in 5 mins.  
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dontcatch
Posts: 403
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Thu Jul 25, 2019 5:32 pm
Dang, you folks make me proud.....proud that I have a 2001 F150 Lariat that I purchased in 2012 (75,500 miles than). Currently has 178K miles and still runs great. Needs a paint job but pull both my boats with ease. Been an excellent truck and has some scratches but no dents. Never saw 3,000 mies with out getting an oil change. You folks have let me know that I will just keep her. At my age and health, I will never get the value out of a new truck....Oh, I paid 6500.00 for that Lariat in 2012...NADA and others had it listed at 12-13,000.

Enjoy your new vehicles!
  
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seayacharlie
Posts: 426
Location: West of home
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Thu Jul 25, 2019 6:14 pm
dontcatch wrote:
Dang, you folks make me proud.....proud that I have a 2001 F150 Lariat that I purchased in 2012 (75,500 miles than). Currently has 178K miles and still runs great. Needs a paint job but pull both my boats with ease. Been an excellent truck and has some scratches but no dents. Never saw 3,000 mies with out getting an oil change. You folks have let me know that I will just keep her. At my age and health, I will never get the value out of a new truck....Oh, I paid 6500.00 for that Lariat in 2012...NADA and others had it listed at 12-13,000.

Enjoy your new vehicles!


My old 2003 F250 5.4L with 110,000 miles better last awhile longer. Seeing the out to door price might help me later
when I go buy one of the trade in models. My local dealer after several purchases has become more
non negotiable on both price, and interest rate. It pays to shop around when needing financing like I do.
Glad you got a good deal on your new truck.
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fishing-misfit
Posts: 76
Location: Hampstead NC
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Thu Jul 25, 2019 8:53 pm
dontcatch wrote:
Dang, you folks make me proud.....proud that I have a 2001 F150 Lariat that I purchased in 2012 (75,500 miles than). Currently has 178K miles and still runs great. Needs a paint job but pull both my boats with ease. Been an excellent truck and has some scratches but no dents. Never saw 3,000 mies with out getting an oil change. You folks have let me know that I will just keep her. At my age and health, I will never get the value out of a new truck....Oh, I paid 6500.00 for that Lariat in 2012...NADA and others had it listed at 12-13,000.

Enjoy your new vehicles!


Well, I am on my 3rd Dodge diesel truck since my first new one in 1999. Traded it with 251k miles, still running like a champ. My 2005 3500 was at 210k miles and running perfect, plus had been paid for since 2008. No telling how long the 05 dually would have lasted for me. But I decided that I just wanted a new Ram dually. Even though neither of my other diesels ever let me down, the new truck was a much better feeling and ride towing boat to Florida Keys a couple months ago, which I plan to start doing at least every Spring.
  
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downeaster
Posts: 355
Location: Carteret County
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Tue Jul 30, 2019 5:53 pm
Bought the first year Nissan Titan with V-8 4wd back in 2004 in order to pull my travel trailer that I had just bought, Was finally able to get rid of the piece of crap trailer after about 6 years but Titan is still running fine and other than normal maintenance has never been in a repair shop . The darn paint or actually the clear coat on the paint has faded badly though but have seen many vehicles with the paint problem. Get 14 MPG around home but around 18 on long trips and only 10 MPG pulling a heavy camper.  
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plasticpeddler
Posts: 327
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Mon Aug 05, 2019 2:25 pm
Everything Tim said is correct. Toyota of Wilmington is full of idiots and the Tundra is awesome...

Pinehurst Toyota and Town and Country in Charlotte will deal also. Hendrick in Wilmington is just plain stupid. I went to Hendrick with a SR5 Tundra lease quote printed from Town and Country. A salesman and sales manager happened to be together. We took a ride while the manager ran the numbers. When we got back, he only wanted to talk in monthly payments and was nearly $200/month higher. He then told me I was a liar and if I could lease a truck for that's what I should do. I actually got a SR5 with the XSP Package from Pinehurst for the same money. I saw the salesman about a month later at a restaurant. He called me by name and he asked me if that was my Tundra in the parking lot. He said "I thought you were looking at a SR5". Then he asked me why I didn't buy it from him. I said "how can you be that stupid with a memory that good". He looked confused...
  
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wavescrash
Posts: 3675
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Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:39 pm
You actually hurt yourself by not financing, IMO. Finance it then pay it off, if that's what you want to do.

Dealers can be tough to deal with. I'd rather by used from a private seller any day.
  
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cjdad
Posts: 241
Location: Reidsville , NC
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Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:01 pm
Got my wife's vehicle from Modern Chevrolet. They were only ones that we could deal with.  
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If you are in the new truck market, read this before buying. - SaltwaterCentral.Com

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